CULTURED’s second annual CULT100 issue spotlights 100 names across five generations who are shaping our culture in real time. Some members of the list are household names; others have been working behind the scenes to make possible the encounters that stop us in our tracks. They are all thinking big, sharing generously, and embodying courage. We hope their work makes you a little braver, too. Order your copy of the CULT100 issue here.
It’s a rarefied group that can count Supreme Court machers as recurring dream protagonists. ACLU attorney Chase Strangio is one of them.
“When the justices start appearing in my dreams, it’s not good,” he remarks. Since graduating from law school in 2010, Strangio has made himself an unavoidable bellwether of the American legal landscape—from defending trans people in New York prisons and jails while working at the Sylvia Rivera Law Project, founded by the country’s first openly trans law professor, to serving as lead counsel for Chelsea Manning in her lawsuit against the Department of Defense. In 2015, he joined the teams fighting for same-sex couples’ fundamental right to marry, and in 2020, he ensured federal employment protections for trans individuals. Last December, when Strangio argued before the Supreme Court for a still-pending case on the banning of gender-affirming medical care for youth, he became the first (known) trans person to do so.
Lawyers—even those working on far less trailblazing cases—are known to swear by a personal rotation of rituals to bolster their mojo, from statue-rubbing to banana-binging. Over the last year, one particularly idiosyncratic talisman found its way into Strangio’s legal binder: a playbill from Oh, Mary! The Broadway smash hit sees Mary Todd Lincoln contemplate leaving her First Lady life behind to become a cabaret performer and has teed up its mastermind and mascot, Cole Escola, as a household name.
Oh, Mary! is the kind of show you hear about even if you don’t follow theater—even if you aren’t actively seeking out what Strangio describes as “true queer excellence.” The satirical biopic’s home run against an increasingly hostile political backdrop has turned it into a flagpole of sorts for dissenters. Just this past March, the president vowed to stop drag performances and the honoring of any “radical left lunatics” at Washington, DC’s Kennedy Center, where he installed himself as chairman—a pit stop on a larger campaign against the public expression of queer culture. But the show must go on. Earlier this month, Escola returned to the Lyceum Theatre stage with the rest of the original Broadway cast for an encore ahead of this year's Tony nominations. Meanwhile, Strangio continues to await the Supreme Court’s decision on United States v. Skrmetti—and with it, the fate of gender-affirming care in the United States.
In the midst of it all, CULTURED sat the two down for a conversation about what unites their seemingly dissimilar cultural output: willpower, a sense of panache, and, of course, a very special playbill.
Chase Strangio: This is very exciting for me.
Cole Escola: Is it? I’m nervous.
Strangio: I said, “If I could talk to anyone in the world, it would be Cole.”
Escola: You’re just so used to thinking intelligently that you wanted a chance to turn your brain off and slum it.
Strangio: For me, it was more that—and I’ve said this to you—over the last two years, feeling creatively inspired is the thing that has kept me going. You’re the person that creatively inspires me the most.
Escola: Thanks. I became aware of you through Instagram—watching you be an advocate, but also having to be a spokesperson for the whole community. Do you feel the pressure of that?
Strangio: Sometimes. This past year, I felt more pressure than I ever have because of this narrative of, “Oh, you’re going to be the first to do something.” It became so loaded. Usually I try to channel that feeling into how grateful I am that I get to be trans in these spaces and the disruptive force it can have. I also get to remind people that we’re in all sorts of places.
“I was worried in the Supreme Court that if I made a little mistake, I would lose all sensibility. And I didn't.” —Chase Strangio
Escola: When I’m really upset or angry, all articulation goes out the window. I resort to name-calling and exaggerations and saying things I don’t even mean. Is it just in your nature to channel your feelings into intelligent expression? When you’re arguing before the Supreme Court, do you worry about getting too emotional?
Strangio: That’s a good question. It’s in my nature to use words and arguments as a defense mechanism. When I’m really upset, I’m like, I’m gonna have to win my argument about why I’m right. I have that tendency, but I’ve learned how to compartmentalize because the work I do can be so infuriating and such an assault on everything I believe as a human, a trans human, and a person who cares about others. I’ve become better at staying focused and analytical, which is hard because you’re sort of like, “Let me analyze for you why it’s wrong to make it a crime to be trans.” That can be difficult.
I think a lot about this video of a kid carrying this cup of coffee over to his mom. He’s shaking, but he’s doing really good. Then, he spills a little bit. He looks at it and just throws the whole cup. I was worried in the Supreme Court that if I made a little mistake, I would just throw the whole cup. I would have a breakdown. That was the fear: that I would lose all sensibility. And I didn't.
Escola: I’m in awe of your ability to keep your cool while being like, “Oh, that’s interesting that you think I’m not human. Here’s why I am.” Being a professional arguer, does that make you a nightmare partner?
Strangio: [Laughs] Well, I’d like to think no. I’m a Scorpio, double Aries. I realize those are nightmare signs for relationships in many ways, but I try to really bring the fire to my advocacy and be much softer in my relationships. Sometimes, my 12-year-old kid is like, “Dad, you’re using your work voice again,” which I think is when I’m being stern and argumentative, laying out my case. I try not to bring my lawyer voice into my intimate relationships.
I want to come back to how I first became aware of you. I saw Difficult People and was truly taken by your comic and performative genius. Then, when Oh, Mary! was still off-Broadway, I didn’t get tickets and put a sad post on Instagram—and you reached out to me with tickets! I’ve brought my Oh, Mary! playbill into court since I saw the play, including at the Supreme Court. I had it in my binder as a reminder that I’m also doing a performance and that I’m channeling people who inspire me when I enter those spaces that are meant to be so serious, but are in fact so absurd.
Escola: This isn’t “make Cole cry hour.” I’m supposed to be asking you questions, but that really means a lot to me. I’m gonna leave it at that. Do you think about the long-term effects of your work, like on jurisprudence? Could you tell that was the first time I’ve ever said jurisprudence?
Strangio: No, it came out very naturally.
Escola: Yeah, I’m preparing for my next show, Oh, Ruth!
Strangio: I’ve been at the ACLU for more than 12 years, and I’ve worked on so many pivotal cases. Obergefell [v. Hodges], which was the marriage equality case, and then a bunch of trans cases including Bostock [v. Clayton County], which was about the federal employment protections covering LGBTQ+ people—our client was fired for being trans. Now, it’s [United States v.] Skrmetti and the question of whether or not we have constitutional protections as trans people. As someone who, I will admit, is very controlling in my work and wants to have a say in how things are constructed when we’re arguing in court about trans people, I feel really grateful that I get to have a role in shaping the arguments that have gone to the federal courts and the Supreme Court over the last 12 years.
I am also aware that the law has such significant limitations and is not going to be our path to liberation. We’re entering a period where so many of the minimal protections that we’ve gained as trans people are on the chopping block in every single way. It feels more critical than ever to engage with our other tools and ways of being human. This, for me, comes back to what it means to be a creative person in the world: to imagine a better set of possibilities.
Escola: This work is so personal to you—not just because of who you are, but who your loved ones are and your community—but you seem healthy and happy. Do you have structure?
Strangio: I think this is the first time someone’s ever said I look healthy and happy, so I hope that makes it into print. I never finish at 6, and I work every weekend, for the most part. My life is consumed by work, but I wouldn’t do it if I didn’t find some energetic joy in it. I’m really motivated by it. I like being around my colleagues; I like being around trans people. Then, I just make sure I do things that fill me up in the times that I am not working. That’s why I appear, in this moment, happy and healthy.
How are you feeling in this moment? Like, the world isn’t great, but you’ve had a very exciting year. How does it feel to celebrate and also watch the world in crisis?
Escola: I feel like a zombie, a little bit. I’m very confused.
Strangio: Is there something that you feel particularly excited about that’s coming up?
Escola: Well, I’m going back into Oh, Mary!
Strangio: I know that’s what I’m excited about. Most people I’ve asked to tell me in the past few years about a work that was powerful and meaningful and they loved, it was Oh, Mary! That changes people in a time of pain and despair.
“What I tell myself every day is that the confusing, unsettling nature of transness for other people is the thing that will spark the revolution we need.” —Chase Strangio
Escola: Well, sometimes in art and culture, we give ourselves too much credit. But I’ll let you give me some credit.
Strangio: I’ll give you credit. A lot of lawyers are given too much credit too.
Escola: We’re just a couple of assholes patting ourselves on the back.
Strangio: Exactly.
Escola: I’m just in awe of what you do and I feel like such an idiot talking to you, but I appreciate you letting me talk to you.
Strangio: Well, I feel very lucky. I hope that my work will make an impact on people’s lives and your life, as you have on mine. We’re just gonna keep fighting. Maybe it will make us feel less zombie-like at times. What I tell myself every day is that the confusing, unsettling nature of transness for other people is the thing that will spark the revolution we need. It’s the uncertainty, the inbetweenness, the traversing of binaries that we offer that’s gonna destabilize the whole thing. That’s what they’re scared of, and they’re right to be scared if they want that type of certainty. I think together, we’re gonna do that.
THE CULT100 Questionnaire
What keeps you up at night?
The fact that we live in a country where people channel their fear and insecurity into being cruel to others keeps me up at night. I simply do not understand the impulse to wield power over and harm others.
What’s one book, work of art, or film that got you through an important moment in your life?
The Wicked movie got me through preparing for my first Supreme Court argument last December. I would manage the anxiety and stress by singing “Defying Gravity” and trying to channel Cynthia Erivo’s Elphaba.
What question do you ask yourself most often while you’re making work?
Doing legal work means building and engaging in a system that causes harm, and so the question I always struggle with is how I can minimize those harms and create more space for people to build expansive and liberatory projects.
What’s something people get wrong about you?
People think I am more serious than I am. I like goofiness, being playful, and watching bad reality TV.
When you were little, what were you known for?
When I was little, I was known for being intense. Proud Scorpio even as a little kid.
What do you want next for yourself above all else?
I would like an indulgent vacation that includes lots of rest and delicious food.
Styling Assistance by Brittney Aceves
